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[Music]

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[Applause]

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ladies and gentlemen

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welcome the moderator of the next two

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sessions patrick tucker

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[Applause]

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hello i'm patrick tucker technology

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editor for defense one

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welcome to our afternoon panel precious

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space a string of satellites and the

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future

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joining me virtually arata olamini

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secretary general emea the satellite

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operations association

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joining from brussels and mr paul jaff

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electronics engineer

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at the u.s naval research laboratory

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joining virtually from washington dc

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welcome to you both

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quick reminder to our audience we are

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prepared to take questions via the

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globesec app

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so uh we have a 20-minute session we do

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ask your

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questions to be brief and hope to be

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able to get to a few of them in this

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session or

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perhaps the next one so let's get

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started the

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last several years have seen an

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explosion in private space

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activity very exciting new business

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models

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around constellations ever smaller less

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expensive satellites but we've also seen

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some small satellite providers grapple

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with great financial difficulties

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and we have seen rising geopolitical

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tensions

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surrounding space so let's start with

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you eroti

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what are the major problems facing the

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satellite industry right now

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and what role does the private sector

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play in overcoming them

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thanks very much patrick it's a pleasure

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to be here my name is arthi

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um but just to say so the major

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challenge

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i think for our sector right now is the

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perception of the relevance of the

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industry to the fast-changing telecoms

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ecosystem

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which now is starting to embrace 5g and

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even thinking about

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6g if the fundamental role that

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satellite has to play in our daily lives

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directly or indirectly is not understood

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then policymakers are going to fail to

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tap the unique strengths of this

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technology

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such as supporting the move towards

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decarbonization

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or leveraging satellite as the great

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equalizer that it is between halves or

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and have nots

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or even looking to the future enabling

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global quantum key distribution for

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secure communications

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uh let me turn to you paul we've seen uh

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tremendous diversity of satellite

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constellations over the last couple of

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years

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and new emerging technologies play a big

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role in their design

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give us a sense of how satellite design

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in the next five to ten years

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differs from even what is cutting edge

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today how does innovation play a role in

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future satellite design

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certainly patrick thank you for the

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opportunity we've seen a lot of the

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growth recently because the industry is

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finally starting to realize the benefits

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of mass production you know for decades

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satellites were these sort of

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one-of-a-kind artisanally crafted

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creations and now they are truly rolling

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off assembly lines and that's one of the

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major factors that's brought down the

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cost

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we also see the promise of the launch

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vehicle providers like

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spacex and blue origin that do truly

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seem to be on a trajectory to make space

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access

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more routine a lot of the services that

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we've come to

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enjoy from satellite systems

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communications and navigation

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may even be further augmented in the

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next five to ten years by

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that of energy if you can imagine a

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system

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where much as gps completely

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revolutionized how we do navigation

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where

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pretty much everyone listening to this

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i'm sure has at least one gps enabled

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device

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there's a possible possibility to do the

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same thing for energy where we might

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have a constellation of satellites in

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orbit that would collect

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energy and be able to distribute it

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globally

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this is fascinating to me uh especially

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when you consider the history

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uh that the u.s navy played in the

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development of the first geopol

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geo-positioning systems in space uh the

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reason we have gps is because some folks

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at the u.s navy uh wanted to figure out

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how to

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position in the sky the sputnik

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satellite and they reversed engineered

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that and came up with

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the global positioning system that we

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today rely on

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uh not just to figure out where we are

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and to figure out where militaries are

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but uh for

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timing functions uh related to financial

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transactions all across the globe

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hugely important constellation so that

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brings up another question space is

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becoming

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increasingly essential not just for uh

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military activity but also for more and

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more uh

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economic life more and more civilian

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life and really the functioning

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of our interconnected global society and

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that leads to

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an ever crowded uh space especially in

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low earth orbit

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so uh what if you if you will rt

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uh how can the international community

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further

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help to mitigate the threat posed by

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space junk and uh ever crowded

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uh satellites especially in low earth

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orbit

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thanks patrick that's a hugely important

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question i think

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management of the overall space domain

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should first and foremost be a public

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sector responsibility

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and it is a huge challenge we are in a

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phase today where private sector

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technical capabilities to launch new

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missions far outpaces the ability of

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of regulators and governments to provide

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force at foresight and deploy governance

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capabilities

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things that we need to look at in terms

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of future actions are

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the maneuverability of assets that fly

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above 400 kilometers because they don't

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burn up themselves

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designs that minimize risk to other

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operators like end-of-life actions like

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removing all stored energy

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decommissioning leo assets within five

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years after the end of life i mean the

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current rules of

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25 years is really out of date and we

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also need to be able to assess the risk

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profile of leo systems which is not easy

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i think we what we really need is more

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investment in monitoring of the space

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environment in all orbits and ensuring

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that existing tracking systems like for

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example the european space surveillance

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and tracking system

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that they develop new capabilities to

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support emerging missions like in-orbit

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servicing

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arti let me stick with you for a second

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uh because you bring up something very

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important which is the potential for

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international regulations regarding

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space and

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where do you see an appetite in terms of

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which nation states which governments

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which international bodies are being

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most ambitious

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pressing for an international dialogue

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on space storms and uh where do you see

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challenges i think it's traditionally

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um the the most obvious space faring

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nations but also the eu

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as a block is a very very proactive

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in in this context right now we're

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talking about the

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the european um the eeas uh

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looking at a code of conduct and trying

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to push that and engage with other major

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governments

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the canada uh

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and so on um but i think you know this

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is a dialogue which is going on at the

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united nations level since many years

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uh there's a lot of activity on it uh

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but what we need is to shift now from

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talking and writing codes of conduct and

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so on

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really to norms and new rules which are

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actionable

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let me turn to you paul what does the

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democratization of the satellite

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industry resemble and i'll also ask

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artie the same question the

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democratization of the satellite

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industry because

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i think that bringing private players

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into

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this discussion at an equal footing

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under that framework of international

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norms is really key

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but we still don't really know what

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democratization of the satellite

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industry looks like so

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can both of you speak on that for a

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second

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yeah certainly so so a major factor

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there has just been

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the plummeting cost of being able to

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implement space systems right so today

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like

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it is not uncommon for high schools

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around the world to be able to build

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their own satellites

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simply because a lot of these items you

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can buy off the shelf and if you can

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imagine that

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high schools are able to operate their

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own space programs certainly companies

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even quite small ones are able to do

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that

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so that definitely amounts to the

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democratization of space

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and the same factors that have enabled

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that are still going to continue to

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radically reshaping the space industry

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as a whole one of the big challenges

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that

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we'll see i think moving forward and

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certainly this would be the case if

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energy from space via power beaming were

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to become a reality

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is the regulation of spectrum this is

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something that i know artie

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is very well versed on but right now

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spectrum is a finite

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resource and we want to make the most of

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it

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but there's not a ton of it available

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for

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a lot of these activities and any of the

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new players even with the

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democratization of space

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are going to have to contend with that

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sure i think more countries than ever

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before are launching satellites

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any university science lab can afford to

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put up a satellite

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there are reusable launchers i mean 10

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years ago nobody had even

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dreamed of that and there's more money

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going into new satellite systems today

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than ever before

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so we want to make sure that this

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dynamic environment continues to thrive

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but i don't think it's a case of what

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does democratization of space look like

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in the future i think we're looking at

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it right now

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okay uh let me stick with you for a

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second already because

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paul brings up this question of spectrum

292
00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:24,240
sharing uh it's

293
00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:25,279
something that a lot of people aren't

294
00:09:25,279 --> 00:09:27,360
necessarily aware of but uh

295
00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:29,680
the electromagnetic spectrum is what

296
00:09:29,680 --> 00:09:31,440
governs the cellular universe

297
00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:33,440
and uh it is bound by the laws of

298
00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:34,720
physics and

299
00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:37,440
uh right now the u.s military and other

300
00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:38,800
organizations are having

301
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:41,839
a big discussion on how to

302
00:09:41,839 --> 00:09:44,160
create sharing of portions of the

303
00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:45,680
electromagnetic spectrum that are owned

304
00:09:45,680 --> 00:09:46,800
by militaries

305
00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:48,720
uh and sharing that with telecom

306
00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:50,320
providers to create 5g

307
00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:52,800
capability uh already give us a sense of

308
00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:54,240
what are the technical

309
00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:56,720
and what are the policy issues

310
00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:58,800
surrounding spectrum sharing as relates

311
00:09:58,800 --> 00:10:01,360
to space

312
00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:04,640
um so iso is very very active

313
00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:07,200
in uh defending satellite spectrum and

314
00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:09,040
uh making sure that

315
00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:10,560
uh the satellite sector satellite

316
00:10:10,560 --> 00:10:12,160
communications in particular

317
00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:14,959
can continue to play their rightful role

318
00:10:14,959 --> 00:10:16,399
whether it's in extending the reach of

319
00:10:16,399 --> 00:10:18,480
5g networks whether it's in enabling

320
00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:19,839
emergency and humanitarian

321
00:10:19,839 --> 00:10:20,880
communications

322
00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:22,800
or whether it's simply in bridging the

323
00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:24,959
digital divide with education health

324
00:10:24,959 --> 00:10:25,360
care

325
00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:28,720
and so on these issues that the

326
00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:30,240
challenge is that you know

327
00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:32,480
there is there is a geopolitical race to

328
00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,720
be the first to roll out 5g

329
00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:38,240
uh yet you have long-standing everyday

330
00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:39,120
requirements

331
00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:41,760
um in more and more in the developing

332
00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:42,399
countries

333
00:10:42,399 --> 00:10:44,320
but also in in developed countries as

334
00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:45,600
well um

335
00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:47,760
to to bring people online and to ensure

336
00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:48,880
essential commun

337
00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:51,200
communications the challenge is to find

338
00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:52,480
the right balance

339
00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:54,720
satellite has had a role to play it will

340
00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:55,760
continue to play

341
00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,480
a vital role and that means that there

342
00:10:58,480 --> 00:10:59,040
are

343
00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:01,200
um there is a need to preserve satellite

344
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:02,480
both

345
00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:04,720
preserve satellite spectrum both for the

346
00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:05,760
satellite sector

347
00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:07,920
but also for imt international mobile

348
00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:09,920
telecoms including 5g and 6g in the

349
00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:11,920
future

350
00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:13,600
let me uh take the same question to you

351
00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:15,519
paul because uh i've been watching the

352
00:11:15,519 --> 00:11:16,720
u.s military

353
00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:18,000
endeavor to do something that is very

354
00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,399
hard which is uh create spectrum sharing

355
00:11:20,399 --> 00:11:23,279
realities to enable uh perhaps one of

356
00:11:23,279 --> 00:11:24,399
the most important enterprises of the

357
00:11:24,399 --> 00:11:26,880
21st century which is 5g capability but

358
00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:27,920
also

359
00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,480
continue to provide very important uh

360
00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:32,480
coverage and communications to

361
00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:35,760
uh military units that are increasingly

362
00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:37,920
uh outspoken in their digital footprint

363
00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:39,040
so how do you see

364
00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:40,880
this technical challenge of spectrum

365
00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:43,839
sharing proceeding from here

366
00:11:43,839 --> 00:11:45,920
certainly and spectrum is a fascinating

367
00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:47,360
resource right because if you think

368
00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:48,560
about it

369
00:11:48,560 --> 00:11:50,639
if you have the spectrum at a given unit

370
00:11:50,639 --> 00:11:52,320
of time if it was not used it's

371
00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:53,920
essentially wasted but it's now in the

372
00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:54,959
past right so

373
00:11:54,959 --> 00:11:57,839
it's not comparable to a lot of other

374
00:11:57,839 --> 00:11:59,279
analogies we might use for natural

375
00:11:59,279 --> 00:12:00,160
resources

376
00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:01,839
so the idea is that you want to use as

377
00:12:01,839 --> 00:12:03,279
much of the spectrum as you can

378
00:12:03,279 --> 00:12:04,800
all the time and that leads to the

379
00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:06,720
spectrum sharing that you described

380
00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:08,639
so there's a quite a few different

381
00:12:08,639 --> 00:12:10,480
approaches and definitely the demand for

382
00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:11,440
spectrum

383
00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,240
hand-in-hand with applications enabled

384
00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:17,040
by 5g the large bandwidth that end users

385
00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:18,160
consistently

386
00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:21,360
demand is is reshaping what things look

387
00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:21,839
like

388
00:12:21,839 --> 00:12:23,839
there are very interesting new

389
00:12:23,839 --> 00:12:25,760
opportunities in this space

390
00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:28,079
one thing that has gotten more attention

391
00:12:28,079 --> 00:12:29,040
recently

392
00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:31,040
is optical communications which doesn't

393
00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:32,959
take the rf spectrum and can be highly

394
00:12:32,959 --> 00:12:33,680
directional

395
00:12:33,680 --> 00:12:35,519
and then there's also quantum

396
00:12:35,519 --> 00:12:36,800
communications

397
00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,040
which uses parts of the spectrum that we

398
00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:40,880
haven't used traditionally

399
00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:43,440
so there are i think a lot of intriguing

400
00:12:43,440 --> 00:12:45,120
opportunities for how the spectrum

401
00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,360
can be used more optimally and certainly

402
00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:48,480
people are looking at

403
00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:51,440
ai techniques for spectrum allocation

404
00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:52,000
and for

405
00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:53,680
spectrum sharing that will help us get

406
00:12:53,680 --> 00:12:55,440
the most out of this

407
00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:58,560
very important and kind of profound

408
00:12:58,560 --> 00:13:00,720
resource

409
00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,360
uh can either you talk about yes please

410
00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:05,360
arty yeah

411
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,120
i think it's very important to remember

412
00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:08,639
that there are millions of people who

413
00:13:08,639 --> 00:13:10,399
rely on satellite communications and

414
00:13:10,399 --> 00:13:12,000
those terminals are often

415
00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:13,680
unregistered people don't know where

416
00:13:13,680 --> 00:13:15,040
they are they could be

417
00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:17,120
tvro so television receive only

418
00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:18,399
terminals um

419
00:13:18,399 --> 00:13:20,160
or it could be broadband communications

420
00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:22,240
elsewhere uh so wherever

421
00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:24,480
satellite is relied on in this kind of

422
00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:25,839
ubiquitous manner

423
00:13:25,839 --> 00:13:27,839
sharing is not possible if we are

424
00:13:27,839 --> 00:13:29,360
talking about protecting

425
00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:32,240
large uh ground stations uh which are

426
00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:34,079
predominantly used for uplinks

427
00:13:34,079 --> 00:13:36,000
there from a technical perspective we

428
00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:37,519
can think about um

429
00:13:37,519 --> 00:13:39,839
sharing but the question of spectrum

430
00:13:39,839 --> 00:13:41,680
sharing is really limited by the laws of

431
00:13:41,680 --> 00:13:43,360
physics there are some places where it's

432
00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:44,000
possible

433
00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,160
and others where it simply isn't and as

434
00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:47,360
i said it's a question of finding

435
00:13:47,360 --> 00:13:48,880
balance

436
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:50,959
uh thank you and i think it's also going

437
00:13:50,959 --> 00:13:52,880
to be a big political discussion too

438
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:54,399
just watching the conversation in the

439
00:13:54,399 --> 00:13:55,440
united states

440
00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,320
around ludago and satellite companies

441
00:13:58,320 --> 00:13:59,519
that are very eager to

442
00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:02,800
uh telecom companies especially absorb

443
00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:04,000
more and more spectrum

444
00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,800
uh and that perhaps comes at a cost of

445
00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:08,720
functionality for other users and so we

446
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:10,880
need to watch that regulation area that

447
00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:12,959
uh political discussion very carefully

448
00:14:12,959 --> 00:14:14,720
uh can you comment question

449
00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,680
from slido can you comment on dual use

450
00:14:17,680 --> 00:14:20,160
government and private satellites so

451
00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:22,320
thinking of private satellites that um

452
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:23,279
also offer

453
00:14:23,279 --> 00:14:25,279
some communications capability for

454
00:14:25,279 --> 00:14:26,720
governments i'm thinking

455
00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:28,720
specifically the darpa blackjack program

456
00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:30,000
but comment a little bit

457
00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:32,079
on how governments are increasingly

458
00:14:32,079 --> 00:14:34,000
turning to private satellite con

459
00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,320
constellations for communications

460
00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:38,079
capabilities that used to be the sole

461
00:14:38,079 --> 00:14:41,040
domain of governments

462
00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:45,120
i'll start with you paul yeah so this is

463
00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:47,760
sort of a classic technology development

464
00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:48,880
conundrum

465
00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,720
where industry of course tends to excel

466
00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:56,000
at developing systems and

467
00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:59,199
making them cost-effective and

468
00:14:59,199 --> 00:15:01,920
operating them but they can only do that

469
00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:02,720
once the

470
00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:04,720
initial technology has been developed

471
00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:05,839
and matured

472
00:15:05,839 --> 00:15:08,160
so the model that we often see and you

473
00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:09,519
made reference to this earlier when you

474
00:15:09,519 --> 00:15:11,120
talked about gps

475
00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:14,480
is the the government's role tends to be

476
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,720
taking those initial additional or the

477
00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:18,639
initial risks rather

478
00:15:18,639 --> 00:15:20,480
uh you could think of it as prospecting

479
00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:21,920
perhaps whereas

480
00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:24,000
industry tends to excel when it comes to

481
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,720
the mining phase right so

482
00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:29,040
to use the gps example again so nrl

483
00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:30,880
developed the first atomic clocks that

484
00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:32,480
were suitable for flying in space

485
00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:34,240
and spaceborne atomic clocks are an

486
00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:35,759
essential element to

487
00:15:35,759 --> 00:15:37,199
create a navigational satellite

488
00:15:37,199 --> 00:15:38,800
constellation like the global

489
00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:40,399
positioning system so

490
00:15:40,399 --> 00:15:42,079
once a government organization or

491
00:15:42,079 --> 00:15:43,440
research organization

492
00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:45,360
like the naval research laboratory

493
00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:46,720
develops like the first

494
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:48,480
gps satellite or the first few gps

495
00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:49,759
satellites it can be transitioned to

496
00:15:49,759 --> 00:15:50,399
industry

497
00:15:50,399 --> 00:15:52,000
and at that point we can start doing

498
00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:53,839
what you're describing which is the

499
00:15:53,839 --> 00:15:55,519
government doesn't really want to be in

500
00:15:55,519 --> 00:15:57,120
the business necessarily

501
00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,360
of operating its own hardware in its own

502
00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:00,240
systems if

503
00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:02,800
it can get the same capability it needs

504
00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:04,560
by purchasing it from industry

505
00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,360
and we see that increasingly for things

506
00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:08,320
like

507
00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:10,639
imagery and for communications where it

508
00:16:10,639 --> 00:16:12,240
would be impractical

509
00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:15,279
for a government to buy all of the

510
00:16:15,279 --> 00:16:18,079
infrastructure needed to maintain

511
00:16:18,079 --> 00:16:21,440
communication systems for a

512
00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,079
conflict when it could just purchase it

513
00:16:24,079 --> 00:16:24,880
as needed

514
00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:26,560
instead of having a lot of unused

515
00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:28,000
capacity that would sit around all the

516
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:29,600
time

517
00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:31,440
artie do you have any thoughts on any

518
00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:34,000
regulation issues or international

519
00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:36,399
issues that might surround that

520
00:16:36,399 --> 00:16:39,199
future use by governments of private

521
00:16:39,199 --> 00:16:40,320
satellites that

522
00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,399
serve a private communications functions

523
00:16:42,399 --> 00:16:43,360
but also

524
00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:45,040
uh increasingly serve military

525
00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:46,480
communications as well

526
00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:51,279
any reservations there are concerns

527
00:16:51,279 --> 00:16:53,360
no i i know that this an extremely

528
00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,279
important market for many satellite

529
00:16:55,279 --> 00:16:56,000
operators

530
00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:58,800
often it's uh one of the prime markets

531
00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:00,240
is government services

532
00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:02,079
because the commercial communication

533
00:17:02,079 --> 00:17:04,400
sector is so good at ensuring that their

534
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:05,919
signals can be encrypted up to a

535
00:17:05,919 --> 00:17:08,160
military military grade

536
00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:10,240
and because they they can guarantee you

537
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:12,240
know the required levels of

538
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:14,079
reliability and availability that are

539
00:17:14,079 --> 00:17:16,559
required um

540
00:17:16,559 --> 00:17:18,559
no that i know that there is always uh

541
00:17:18,559 --> 00:17:20,160
some kind of pressure from

542
00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:23,439
um european industry to uh

543
00:17:23,439 --> 00:17:26,799
uh encourage european governments to to

544
00:17:26,799 --> 00:17:29,840
to buy uh european capacity for that uh

545
00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:31,600
because we see that in the u.s for

546
00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:32,080
example

547
00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:33,919
the the government is always calling

548
00:17:33,919 --> 00:17:35,600
upon its own industry

549
00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:38,799
and that is a source of um you know that

550
00:17:38,799 --> 00:17:40,799
can support the technology advancement

551
00:17:40,799 --> 00:17:42,160
and the competitiveness of national

552
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:42,799
industries

553
00:17:42,799 --> 00:17:45,200
we do see some push for that in the eu

554
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:46,799
but nothing specifically when it comes

555
00:17:46,799 --> 00:17:48,640
to regulation and policy making around

556
00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:48,960
it

557
00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:51,760
thanks yes okay so we have time for uh

558
00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:53,520
one last question and it goes to me

559
00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:55,600
uh thinking about the current

560
00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:57,120
geopolitical tensions

561
00:17:57,120 --> 00:18:00,320
surrounding space uh the development of

562
00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:01,039
a

563
00:18:01,039 --> 00:18:03,039
new u.s service branch the u.s space

564
00:18:03,039 --> 00:18:05,840
force uh specifically to deal with the

565
00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:07,440
uh those geopolitical tensions

566
00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:09,039
surrounding space and ensuring space

567
00:18:09,039 --> 00:18:10,640
access for the united states and u.s

568
00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:12,400
allies and uh democracies around the

569
00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:13,120
world

570
00:18:13,120 --> 00:18:15,120
what do you see as the biggest

571
00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:17,360
geopolitical challenge going forward in

572
00:18:17,360 --> 00:18:19,039
the next five to ten years

573
00:18:19,039 --> 00:18:21,840
regarding uh establishing those norms

574
00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:23,360
that you just described

575
00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:25,360
i'll start with you artie the biggest

576
00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:26,960
geopolitical challenge

577
00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:28,799
regarding the governance of space for

578
00:18:28,799 --> 00:18:31,679
the next five to ten years

579
00:18:31,679 --> 00:18:33,760
i think the the biggest challenge that

580
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:34,880
we have

581
00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,280
is ensuring space traffic management

582
00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:39,280
solid space traffic management

583
00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:42,160
uh governance of of space and weighing

584
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:42,799
that up

585
00:18:42,799 --> 00:18:45,360
with uh the race to have the first leo

586
00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:46,320
broadband

587
00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:49,360
uh system which is also as you know

588
00:18:49,360 --> 00:18:51,679
the the with starlink you have huge

589
00:18:51,679 --> 00:18:52,960
government support there

590
00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:54,240
the chinese are trying to build their

591
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:55,919
own system you have one web now the

592
00:18:55,919 --> 00:18:57,760
european union is also trying to get in

593
00:18:57,760 --> 00:18:58,240
there

594
00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:00,640
i mean with all of these races going on

595
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:02,160
where you know i think that space

596
00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,000
traffic management ultimately because it

597
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:04,640
requires

598
00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:06,240
international consensus and it's

599
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:07,919
sensitive often is

600
00:19:07,919 --> 00:19:09,520
unfortunately going to take a back seat

601
00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:11,919
and i think that's a great shame

602
00:19:11,919 --> 00:19:15,520
paul to you same question yeah

603
00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:18,480
this is a critical issue because as you

604
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:20,080
describe with the democratization of

605
00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:20,559
space

606
00:19:20,559 --> 00:19:22,480
the increasing availability of space

607
00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:24,799
access to countries and other entities

608
00:19:24,799 --> 00:19:25,919
around the world

609
00:19:25,919 --> 00:19:28,320
the establishment of these norms is

610
00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:30,559
going to be of the utmost importance

611
00:19:30,559 --> 00:19:33,120
and this is something where definitely

612
00:19:33,120 --> 00:19:34,559
there are going to be implications not

613
00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:36,160
just for low earth orbit where a lot of

614
00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:37,600
our systems are today but

615
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:39,520
expanding further outward to cis lunar

616
00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:42,160
space and the moon itself we have the

617
00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:43,280
chinese who have done

618
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:45,919
remarkable technological feats putting

619
00:19:45,919 --> 00:19:47,360
satellites in the earth

620
00:19:47,360 --> 00:19:50,880
moon l2 point and operating on the moon

621
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:52,799
we're going to have to face property

622
00:19:52,799 --> 00:19:54,559
issues and usage

623
00:19:54,559 --> 00:19:58,000
rights things for not just earth orbit

624
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:01,440
but the moon and for cis lunar space

625
00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:03,760
so a new infinite and expanding

626
00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:05,520
territory not just for human activity

627
00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:06,080
but also

628
00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:08,480
potentially for regulation so i want to

629
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:10,080
thank the two panelists

630
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,039
uh artie olomaini from brussels and paul

631
00:20:13,039 --> 00:20:14,559
jaff from washington d.c

632
00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:16,480
we will continue with the next session

633
00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:18,000
titans of technology

634
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:19,360
winning the future of defense right

635
00:20:19,360 --> 00:20:21,360
after a short introduction video

636
00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:22,880
so please don't go anywhere we'll be

637
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,120
back very soon

638
00:20:25,120 --> 00:20:34,880
thanks better

639
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:36,960
i